Gevlon Goblin put out another article today,
this time talking about how the changes to WH space will be a positive thing
for the gameworld.
*sigh*
Let’s get the “Damnit, Gevlon…” stuff out of the way. Good writers who talk about Eve are up front
and honest about their biases, and they call them out directly when they
propose a change that benefits their perspective. Personally, I’ve been pretty clear that I believe
small gang PvP is the pinnacle of the Eve experience, since it blends both the
social aspect and the thrill of having your actions influence the result. When I propose changes that benefit this playstyle,
I actively call it out, and I try not to propose changes that advance small
gang at the expense of other play styles.
And I’ve certainly written about the virtues of the other playstyles,
too. Hell, the purpose of this blog is
to make PvP more transparent to players making their first forays into PvP.
Gevlon makes no such effort to state his biases. He’s a WoW player who uses charts and graphs
to try to plot the optimal way to “win” a game.
He obviously applied this methodology to WoW, and he tries the same with
Eve. That, in itself, demonstrates that
he just doesn’t get Eve.
He writes, “Because C4+ WH space is as far from the original design as
it could be. It was meant to be a great unknown, where unexpected things
happen, due to the random connections. This randomness was destroyed by the
“ragerolling” process.”
This represents an absolute failure to recognize the very nature of Eve. WH space isn’t what CCP intended… who cares? CCP sure doesn’t. Nor does anyone who “gets” Eve. Similar real-world examples of this line of thinking: “The abuses of power and inequality in communism isn’t what Marx intended.” “Businesses dropping benefits in lieu of Obamacare isn’t what Obama intended.” In all cases: consequences are not related in any way to intentions, but by facts, human nature, logic, and emergence. Only a fool looks at consequences and cites intention.
He seems to wholly miss the essence of Eve: emergent gameplay is the whole
point, not an aberration. Whatever a
player CAN do within the mechanics is a positive aspect. It is wholly impossible for players to RUIN
the game with their actions; the game IS their actions. If there’s a problem, it’s a consequence of
insufficient coding and mechanics (note, I didn’t say failure; no one can
predict everything, though the programmers do a good job of trying to). If there’s a problem, the code needs to be
adjusted, not regulations added.
Why? Because of the slippery
slope. If you start limiting emergent
gameplay to only those elements you favor, you’re exercising despotism. “Why can we not do this? Because I said so.” That very line of thinking negates what Eve
is about. Either Gevlon doesn’t realize
this, or he doesn’t see a problem with this tendency.
I have to put this disclaimer in lest some reader believe Gevlon’s
perspective is in some way balanced. I
was one of those readers in the past, and made the mistake of giving him the
same benefit of the doubt I give everyone I read; the deception inherent in his
thinking can easily be overlooked.
For the Argument’s Sake
Deep breath.
Yes, when Gevlon writes something, I’m naturally opposed to it. I can’t help it; the intellectual dishonesty
and shameless bias he demonstrates, coupled with his despotic tendencies,
triggers a natural revulsion and urge to obliterate it. That said, I try very hard not to conflate
the value of ideas expressed and the value of the individual expressing
them. So I’m going to try to overcome my
own bias and consider his ideas on their own merit.
I’m not quite sure what point of the author’s analysis is, to be
honest, other than “more people doing PvE is good.” To some extent, I agree with that conclusion,
but only as an instrumental good, not an intrinsic good. PvE is valuable as a pass-between – to make
isk to fund war, to provide content to hunters, to provide resources to be used
in PvP – but CCP’s data has shown that players who only engage in PvE burn out and
provide lower total value (interactions times subscription duration) than
players who engage in PvP as well. The
ideal PvEr is the player who will jump into a home defense fleet to fight off
invaders. That behavior presupposes
social connection, engagement with multiple aspects of the game, and emotional
investment in something one wishes to protect.
All of those are good for CCP, Eve, and all of us.
Further, I don’t see the internal logic of the argument that WH space “was
meant to be a great unknown, where unexpected things happen, due to the random
connections. This randomness was destroyed by the ‘ragerolling’ process. In
this a ganker group repeatedly overloads their static wormhole with capital
ships, creating a new one, until they got which they wanted.” When I spent time in a WH corp, rolling
wormholes was as much about defense as it was about finding targets. We’d purge our home system of random WHs and
maintain only the static, so we could control the number of entrances and exits
to make PvE more secure. Yes, sometimes
we rage-rolled connections to identify possible targets, but most of our
targets were found by exploring our chains.
Moreover, we tended to use plated battleships with active MWDs to close
holes, not capitals, and it didn’t take that long regardless. I honestly don’t see how rage-rolling a dead
system will be that much more difficult, or will take more time.
Perhaps this comes from a failure to understand how you rage-roll. When a new static appears, you send your
probers to it. They jump through, do a
quick scan of that WH, then identify the location of the various WH signatures
in system to see if there’s any value in continuing beyond the static. This all takes a few minutes, even with
multiple probers. If they find nothing,
they come back, you calculate the mass with your WH mapper tool, then bring your
plated BS fleet in, flashing MWDs until you close your WH. You can usually do this in a single
pass-and-back. Most of the time involved
is spent scouting the new connection.
Closing it is relatively quick and easy.
Ironically, making it more difficult to roll a WH will only hurt those
groups trying to defensively close a WH.
If you and an enemy fleet are fighting on a WH, the only time you want
to close it is if you’re losing or are outnumbered. Doing so under the new mechanics is much more
difficult, since you’ll have to burn back to the WH to escape. After all, if you’re winning the fight, you
want it to stay open as long as possible, don’t you. Kill orgies are best enjoyed to excess.
So, this change isn’t going to really make it more difficult to roll
statics, it’ll only make it more difficult to close a WH behind you to cut off
a superior force if you’re getting your face kicked in. If anything, this aspect favors the superior
force (or, in Gevlon’s parlance, the “gankers”).
The rest of the article makes some confusing claims about WH life. It argues that, “Currently ratting in C4-C6
is like ratting in nullsec, one jump away from the staging system of every
serious Null group, with multiple neutrals on local.” I’m not even sure what he means by part of
it, but the part I do understand is his presentation; the claim is made as if
the current state is a problem needing correction. But, I fail to see how “returning” WH space
to that “great unknown” state, where “unexpected things happen, due to the
random connections” would be achieved by making it safer to rat in higher-class
WHs in the first place, nor how any of the changes in the dev blog could make
WH ratting safer.
If anything, the changes seem to introduce instability – additional WHs
that cannot be closed due to limited jump mass and regenerating total mass
restrictions, additional statics to create “crossroads C4s”, delays in K162
wormhole visibility until a ship passes through initially. I honestly fail to see how “ratting should be
easier”, “WH space was meant to be unpredictable and unsafe,” and “gankers and
PvP pilots should have harder jobs” can all mutually exist within the same
philosophy.
I’ll share my own take on these changes in a separate post, since I’d really rather
not mix illogical arguments with logical ones.
"He seems to wholly miss the essence of Eve: emergent gameplay is the whole point, not an aberration. Whatever a player CAN do within the mechanics is a positive aspect. It is wholly impossible for players to RUIN the game with their actions; the game IS their actions."
ReplyDeleteAOE cruise missile kestrels. Permatanking/evading concord. Yulai superhub. Unscannable deep safes. Pax Amarria nocxium price cap. Something from nothing starbase reactions. Biomass cycling suicide gank alts. FW LP dubstep. Convo bombing. Server tick POS bowling. FW mission blitzing under old tiered discount payouts. Suspect baiting in newbie systems. etc etc.
There have been plenty of cases where emergent behavior that didn't match CCP intentions have led to people unbalancing and even outright ruining the game for others. If emergent behavior in all its forms was the point of the game, then none of those underlying mechanics that permitted such behavior would evern have been patched out, or in the cases where they can't be patched out such as suicide alt biomass cycling, server tick POS bowling, or baiting newbies in starter systems, they would never have been explicitly forbidden through GM fiat.
You may have different opinions compared to Gevlon on what emergent behavior is good for the game, but the idea that just because the game encourages emergent behavior, all such possible behaviors must be good is a flawed one. There have been plenty of past examples that show it to be demonstratably false.
All of your examples are players using the tools provided. That's how the game's supposed to be played. CCP made a mistake, and the players exploited it. Let me put it to you a different way; if you leave a Bowie knife sitting on the floor and your toddler comes up and stabs herself with it, the fault lies with you, not your toddler.
DeleteChanging mechanics is one thing; it's CCP providing players with tools - and adjusting those tools - to establish a universe with set rules. But saying, "Though the mechanics allow you to do this, you aren't allowed to," is moralizing. It's something other games do, not Eve. The very appeal of Eve is that the GMs do NOT moralize.
By all means, CCP should adjust the mechanics to achieve balance. But what Gevlon wants is for CCP to dictate playstyle through any means they can. That's the very apex of totalitarianism.
Gevlon is someone whom I read but what they say is just background noise. His crusade against Goons and their allies is to the point of boring and laughable but he does occasionally make good observations.
DeleteThat said I agree fully with your last paragraph in the comment Talvorian Dex, he wants the gameplay to be dictated by CCP not the players and this is totally opposite to how EVE was designed and is played.
The changes that have been suggested are good, especially the use of capital ships to close holes. I really like that one and it suggests that in the future we may see something similar for cyno's (if you take a small leap).
Players have been up in arms about these changes and the fear and anger displayed in some of the forum comments are laughable. Pilots will adapt and new gameplay styles will come from these changes, its a good thing.
What difference does it make how another person thinks?
ReplyDeleteIn general, no matter how a world developer alters that world, players will tend to gravitate towards pursuing mechanics that put them at the least risk, even if those are engagement mechanics. In a competitive game, the developer generates the most adaptation by making that move more expensive than it was previously. Adding a little more risk to WH jumping or anything else can't really be a bad thing. In an universe where the only real permanent consequence of suffering is wisdom, risk makes sense, even if we can't objectively convince ourselves to seek it out most of the time.
Good opinion. I tend to agree with you, but to your question: it matters a great deal what another person thinks. CCP's decisions are indeed influenced by the narrative and the tenor of discussion among player circles. A voice with a strong reach can influence that narrative.
DeleteWords have power. Writers are a self-policing lot; when we see someone trying to pull one over - linguistically, argumentatively, or logically - on someone, we can't do anything but respond. We know that a bad idea can take root and become an epidemic of poor thinking. And so, we try to stop it as soon as we can.